I need help with cropping in Photoshop for a large print

[MarkY]

I'm new to digital photography and Photoshop and need some help and
explanations of how/what cropping actually does.

I'm using a C5050 and Photoshop 7.1

If I want to make a large print of a photo I took with my
C5050 what steps do I need to do in Photoshop before I send the file to
a place that can print it?

I assume my first step will be to make all changes to the photo. After
all the changes are made, do I just crop the photo without dimensions?

Once the photo is cropped, if I do a "save as" on the photo, do I need
to concern myself about the PPI. I believe the default for PS is 72.
This is where my confusion lies. If I want to make a 12x18 print, how should I size the tiff file? The original file is 2560 x 1920 pixels.

Along the same line, does anyone have a recommendation for a place to
print the photo?

Thanks for any help.

[bradt]

http://www.photozo.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1376

Take a look at that thread Mark. Should answer some of the questions.

I would save it as a jpeg. Some labs don't use tiffs, and jpeg seems to be the norm for the printers.

brad
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[MarkY]

Thanks for the great thread Brad. I'm looking to get a print made from an original image of 2560 x 1920. What is your opinion of how large I can make a print and still have excellent quality? I've heard I shouldn't go larger than 12 x 18. But, the folks at printroom.com said that I should be able to get an excellent print all the way up to 20 x 30.

What are your thoughts?

Thanks again for the info.

[bradt]

Mark, a lot of it depends on the printer.

On a machine running at 300 ppi (which seems to be pretty standard for now) your image would be roughly 6x8.

I don't know that I'd be hopeful for anything above 11x14. You may be able to squeeze a 12x18 out of it. Then you're close to doubling the image size, and when you get to larger prints flaws become much more noticeable.

I just looked at printroom, and they must be using a low res printer, or define excellent qualty very loosely. I don't see how you could get an excellent 20x30 out of a 2400x1800 file like they say on their site.

The best thing to do if you're in doubt is to find out what resolution they print at and convert your image to that to take a look. If it starts to distort then you're probably not going to get a good print at that size. I looked, but they don't list their resolution on the site, so you may need to send them a message. I would certainly do that before dropping 10 bucks plus postage on a print I wasn't sure about.

brad
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[MarkY]

Brad:

Thanks again for the help. I emailed printroom.com, here is my message:

Hi:
Can you tell me what resolution you print at, specifically a 20 x 30 print?
Once I know this, I'll convert my image and view my picture to see if this
is acceptable to me.

Here is their reply:

Hello,

The image resolution of a 20x30 is 2048x1536.

It doesn't appear they really answered the question. This much information was listed on their web site. Now if I do the math according to your other thread, I would get the following:

x * 20 = 1536
y * 30 = 2048

x = 76.8 and y = 68.27

This doesn't seem all that great. What are your thoughts?

Thanks again.

[Stuart Elflett]

I have a 60" X 40" print on my wall, from a 1600 X 1200 crop from a 2272 X 1704 image from the G2... you would be gobsmacked to see it... when viewing an enlargement, you don't push your nose against it to see pixels, so some of the 300DPI rules don't apply...

I've printed a huge amount of 12" X 18" prints from a Konica QD21+ from 2272 X 1704 and cropped for composition files, and they're all stunning... 12" X 18" was as big as they could print, but only cost AUD$4, or about US$2.50... it's an easy $50 sale to a client, makes a nice size to frame... the QD21+ is actually a 240DPI printer, not 300DPI, but continuous tone makes up for it...

I have a friend in the states who had a number of Canon G2 shots blown up to 20" X 30" and mounted on hard board backing... butterflies and the like... she did an exhibition of them, so the quality must be there... that was from a poster/photo place on the net, mounted by a friend of hers...

Cheers,
Stuart

[bradt]

I have a 60" X 40" print on my wall, from a 1600 X 1200 crop from a 2272 X 1704 image from the G2... you would be gobsmacked to see it... when viewing an enlargement, you don't push your nose against it to see pixels, so some of the 300DPI rules don't apply...

I'm surprised you got that. They must have been printed on a dye sub or something similar where they can use a lower res file. We could barely get a decent 11x14 out of the frontier at that res.

I would still suggest finding out what they are doing before dropping 10 bucks for one print, or at the least what sort of guarantee they have. Seems awfully high to me.

brad
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[Steve]

An inkjet print, viewed at normal viewing distances (!), will begin to show pixelation at file resolutions of less than 200ppi. This is not to be confused with printer resolution. So, with a 2048x1536 file size, a 'photo quality' print would be no more than 10" x 7". Also, 'begins to show pixelation' is a subjective term - an experienced photographer would probably see it, but quite probably the average person wouldn't notice it until you went down to around 160ppi.

But, you also have to consider your audience, and the intended viewing distance. There is also the option of resampling the file to increase the pixel count, although the image degrades in the process.

For a pic framed above my fireplace, from my 2200 Epson, I wouldn't hesitate to go to 16x20 on a 2048x1536 file - because I know that people can't get too close to it.

Anyway, you get the idea. As with most things in photography, it's a judgement call - yours!

steve