Freelance Photography

[Phoenix]

Hi

I have been thinking about doing some freelance photography.
I was wondering if there is still a big market for it.

I am looking to sell to Magazines, greeting cards, and who ever else that will buy them for a good price.

I know there is a lot of submitting and rejections to go through but if I keep at it I am sure to sell something.

The equipment I am using is the Canon 40D with a 28-135mm lens, right now that is all I can afford.

I have looked into stock photography and registered on shutterstock.com still have not submitted my 10 images. For the quality of images stock photography is asking for I am wondering if freelance will be a better idea. I know in stock you have more of a selection of topics I could work on and more of a chance of them selling, but it brings in a small amount of money very slowly.

If it is possible, any ideas what business to target? Or is it a hit and miss game of who will buy the image?


Thanks
Rob

[traveler36]

Phoenix, in case you've not seen it, I had a short discussion about this with Mobohaji in his "ML&E" entry in the transportation forum. Fascinating work, when you get it.

[Phoenix]

Thanks Ron, a lot of info there. But it sounds like they have Mobohaji name at the top of their stack, which will be a few years if I keep at it before my images keep showing up.

Does anyone have any Do's and Don't's also any tips on who in the Magazien field to send the photo to, I would send it to the editor Right?

Anyone I should target first, just to break into the field? And who pays and who doesn't?

[loco-lobo]

Have a look at Photographer's Market. It's a standard reference that any library should have. It lists a lot of photo buyers (magazines, books, cards, stock agencies, and so forth), roughly what they pay, what they are interested in, submission policies and contact information. Some of the data is dated, so use the book to figure out who to look more closely at. After you figure out some possibles, buy the magazine, look at the website, etc, etc, etc.
Good luck!

[MoboHaji]

Rob, there are many ways to make money at photography and just as many ways to go about it.

Stock photography is simply a numbers game. The old rule of thumb used to be "A dollar for every photo in your stock collection". So, to make $10k a year, you would need 10k sellable images in your collection. This was back when there was a lot less people shooting stock (digital and royalty free sites like istock and shutterstock have only weakened the market) and the stock houses were able to move more images. These days, a lot of stock houses are not excepting new photographers and many of them are not excepting images of a certain type (like glamour or birds). If you ever plan to make photography your career, I'd stay away from places like shutterstock and istock. They only dilute your work's "perceived value". That said, those place can be good outlets for your not so good shots.

Freelance work takes a lot of leg work to break into. You have to know what segment of the market you are going to pursue first. This can be sports, wildlife, flowers, cars, ect. Once you decide what you want to shoot, you really have to get out there and shoot that subject until you have a very nice, well balanced portfolio. You need to constantly compare it to your competition's work and update it (which reminds me I need to do that!). Then it's just a matter of getting your work in front of the right person at the right time. You have to tailor your portfolio to the client, no car magazine editor wants to see a portfolio that has wildlife photos in it...no matter how nice they are.

Scott listed a great source for information. I've never actually used it, but I have looked at it before. If you are wanting to shoot for magazines, pick the ones you want to shoot for and then buy several different issues so you can get a feel for what they use/need. Also pay very close attention to the page that list all of the editors and writers. There is a wealth of info on who to talk to hidden in there.

If you have any specific questions, post them up and I'll try to answer them as best I can (just keep in mind that my thoughts and posts are just from my own experiences...which is not very great).

[Phoenix]

Thanks Scott and Keith.

Ill be sure to check out that book.

Yah I don't want to shoot for Shutterstock, I don't see why they should get paied the big bucks for my images.

I understand its a lot of work to start out, but it brings in good money if you keep at it.

Right now I am reading the book "Photos That Sell" By Lee Frost it has some really good information.

Thanks again
Rob

[MoboHaji]

I would also recommend these books...

ASMP Professional Business Practices in Photography
ISBN 1-58115-197-7

The Photographer's Guide to Marketing & Self-Promotion
ISBN 1-58115-096-2

Photographer's Market: Guide to Building Your Photography Business
ISBN 1-58297-264-8

The first one listed is quite in depth on the information and will have you doing a lot of "business work". It brings up a lot of things you need to think about before, during and after a shoot. The last two are more general information books about marketing geared towards photography.

One other good book is 88 Secrets to Selling & Publishing your Photography by Scott Bourne. ISBN 0-9761878-0-9. It can also be downloaded from their website (http://www.mountainschoolpress.com/gallery1.htm).

[brucep]

Once you decide what you want to shoot...

None of my freelance pictures were taken prior to receiving an assignment from my clients. When you develop a bit of a name for yourself (through networking, etc.... getting everyone you know familiar with your work... maybe working free for non-profits, etc.), people will phone you and ask you to (for instance) take photos of their grand opening of their new business, take photos for their annual report, even take evidence photos of a poor auto paint job (harder than it sounds), etc.

My client base was developed by teaching 35mm photography through the recreation departments in four cities during the evenings (while I worked my day newspaper graphics job) and I worked that into doing family portraiture (I'd been formally trained in this) and high school seniors. That spread the word and got my name and abilities out there.

It didn't happen overnight, and would take years to develop again, living in a different community as I do now.

[Phoenix]

Thanks Bruce,

Great idea on the non-profit work. I do have one connection with a Sports photographer, but I need to catch him when he is home. He has been out of town. I should e-mail him again. He also does portrait photography maybe he will let me work with him on that.

Thanks
Rob

[imagesbytlp]

Rob, I wasn't really planning on doing a whole lot these couple of years while I stayed home with my kids. My business kind of took off while I wasn't looking. I've connected with some small business'...shooting employee portraits and product shots. I've just formed a partnership with a small web design company...and all their new clients need pictures for their websites...so, they send them to me. I just made $1300 shooting pizza's and sandwiches for a local pizza joint. And, I really don't have any overhead...which makes that profit.

The best thing I ever did...find a mentor or get a studio job (photographers assistants don't make much...but, the knowledge and experience is worth it!)!! I did both!! You would be amazed how much you will learn!

[Phoenix]

Thanks Terry
As a sports photographer assistant I would only make $100 a day so yah your right not much money. But then you have people going to college and paying big bucks to learn all of this. I always like the idea of getting paied to learn.

Its too bad I would have had a lot more connections right now if I started out with a better camera. Now I just need to get my name out there.


Thanks
Rob

[MoboHaji]

Just wondering, how would a better camera get you more connections???

[Phoenix]

I don't see People wanting to spend their money on someone with a point and shoot. They would rather pay somone with an SLR.

There is the stigma that you get better pictures with an SLR.


Rob

[Phoenix]

Do you still need to send in Hard copys or is it all through Email? The book I am reading says to add a Copy Right logo with information on the photo. Is that just a givin or do I still need to do that?

Rob

[MoboHaji]

With the editors that I work with, every thing has been in digital files. I've never sent in a slide or print. For the final shoot, I upload the images to their server and also mail them a Cd/DVD with all of the RAW files on it.

I don't think it's a stigma that SLRs produce better images then a point and shoot.... they do. Of course, if the person behind them is clueless, you will not see any difference. That being said, none of my clients have seen my gear before they have hired me. They see the end result of my work and skill. But why are you concerned with the "stigma" of SLR vs. PnS when you own a 40D?

[Phoenix]

But why are you concerned with the "stigma" of SLR vs. PnS when you own a 40D?

No I am not concerned, I was talking about before I owned the 40D. Mostly I guess it was in my head since I did not like my last camera for several reasons, but I did offer my work to other people with my Sony and I got no takers.

I did one job with it but it was for a family members business and she blew it up poster size (It was surprisingly good quality for the size she printed) can't remember what size it was.

[imagesbytlp]

How's your portfolio looking? Do you have a website? Business cards with your website on it? These can be your best friend...hand out your card to everyone and let your website represent...

[Phoenix]

I don't have much of a portfolio I reject most of my images. The website is a free site and I am not finished building it yet. The cards are just basic, all they have is my Name phone number and Email. I should make some new ones for photography only.

For a beginner what subjects do you think I should start out with? I have done not to bad with product photography, I am going to build a light tent. I am just a few parts short but I have most of them, I am building it out of PVC pipe. I got the instructions from the site!

Well I need to stop thinking about freelance and start shooting huh? I need to find some ideal subjects that could be published.


Rob


Edit:
What I am trying to do here is put together a kind of a business plan so I know what I am going to need to do to start out. This is not just a dream. It is a plan.

[MoboHaji]

So, you are looking at doing commercial product photography? That can be a little rough to break into unless you live in a large city or manufacturing area. If you don't live in one of those areas, start out by going to arts and craft fairs. Talk to and hand out your photography only cards to everyone that makes some thing. Your rates will have to be pretty low for these types of clients, but it will get your name out there and most importantly, build a product portfolio rather quickly.

You also need to get a good looking site up before you do any of that. Also, as much as I hate to say it, it can not be a free site. These early days of your photo business are like the foundation to a new home... you need it solid and reliable. The good news is, web hosting is very cheap these days. There are tons and tons of places to be hosted out there, but look into PowWeb (http://www.powweb.com/powweb/index.bml). I have been using them for years for multiple sites. Your site needs to display your images as the main subject of the site and also offer info about who you are. Keep this part short and related to photography.

[brucep]

I don't see People wanting to spend their money on someone with a point and shoot. They would rather pay somone with an SLR.

There is the stigma that you get better pictures with an SLR.

Rob

I've never had a client or employer ask (or care) what kind of camera I use unless they were speaking as an amateur interested in getting better photos. I've always been judged solely on my photos and having good references.

[Phoenix]

Well it looks like I have a lot of work to look foward to. But I think its worth it.

Thank you all very much for all the help.


Rob