HELP! Canon wireless flash.

[PPPhoto]

I know we've got some members here who are more familiar with using Canon's wireless flash system. I'm needing help with how to set them up and get a good exposure.

I borrowed a 550EX from a co-worker/friend and am using that with my 430EX and 420EX.

I've searched the "net" looking for help, but haven't come across anything that really tells me what I want to know.

I've adjusted the ratios, using the 430EX as my key light, the 550EX as a fill, and trying to use the 420EX for the background.

Everything is coming out much darker than I would like it too. I've tried shooting on P, Av, and M, and bumping the ISO up to 400.

The following image is close to what I want to achieve. The problem with it is that I had to adjust the "Exposure" setting way up (about +2) in Camera Raw to get it looking like this. Obviously this is going to add some noise to the image, in addition to using ISO 400. For my daughters, no big deal, but for a paying customer it would be unacceptable.

What I'm really interested in is know that most basic setup: ratios, distances, angles, etc. I think I know this, and that's what I'm using, but it's not working quite right.

Thanks for the help.

http://lh3.ggpht.com/pifersprophoto/SDYj5NMce7I/AAAAAAAABmI/4VQWaV5i2Xg/s800/amber_port.jpg

[brucep]

Will the 420EX or 550EX work as a slaves? Is there a switch which says, "Slave"? I work with two 580EX's and I used to also use a 430EX together with them.

I just put my camera on Manual and the flashes on ETTL. I follow what the flash manual (http://brucephilpott.com/photos/580EX_Manual.pdf) says (pages 32-43). Those last few pages get more specific about multiple flash groups (you may want to use three groups even though you're only using three flashes... for more individual control).

I'd start out following the instructions with just two flashes. The camera mounted fill light will be in group A and the off camera slaved main light will be group B. Work in extreme ratios at first so you can see the differences in settings.

Canon's way of numbering that ratio slider is really strange. In the manual, though, you'll see that you can get 1:2.8 ratio (one to three, roughly) by moving the indicator to half-way between the 1:2 and the 1.4 mark... Hey... that would be 1:3! (why don't they just say so?).

In setting it to 3:1, you'll find that you've set the fill to twice the power of the main... just move the indicator to the other side, to 1:3 and see how that looks.

Camera on manual; flash on ETTL; on-camera flash set to Master, both off-camera flashes set to Slave. Go for it! It's a great system.

[PPPhoto]

Bruce, the 550EX is my master, and the other two are the slaves. I did set my key light (430EX) as group A, the fill (550EX) as B, and the background (420EX) as C. I understand how to set the ratio with A and B, but I don't really understand how to set C properly.

When shooting the camera on manual, what's a good starting point for shutter and aperture? I guess I was assuming that the flashes would put enough light out to help with the exposure, but they don't seem to. Do I need to set my flash exp. comp. to the + side?

I still have some time to play with it before I have to give the 550EX back. I hope to get a 580EX for myself someday, maybe 2 580s, or perhaps another 430 with 1 580.

[brucep]

That A-B-C adjustment is on page 42.

If I'm hand-holding the camera and I want to capture ambient light (which I usually want to do when I'm not working with "studio" lighting) I use the longest shutter speed I can hand hold. That's not the case "in the studio."

I use the maximum flash sync shutterspeed (probably 1/250th on your camera) and start out with my aperture wide open and take a test shot. Simple? I have a flashmeter, but with ETTL it's not necessary.

Yes, you can use your flash compensation, but I haven't found it necessary. ETTL has always seemed like some kind of miracle to me!

BTW, the reason I use a fast shutterspeed is so the exposure isn't complicated by light other than the flashes I'm using. I use a tripod for convenience so I don't have to hold the camera for a long time and then be careful when I've put it down on the floor, but the tripod's not really needed when using "studio" flash.

I have a new "studio" at work (it's the winemakers' private conference room... small and ALL WHITE!). I just point two flash units at the ceiling (from below the level of the conference table... out at the sides, behind my product) and hand-hold the camera and take quick bottle shots which turn out better than my setting up softboxes!

[PPPhoto]

It figures that you would do that to me Bruce. Now I have to wait for the manual to finish downloading. When I borrowed the flash, the manual didn't make the trip.

Thanks for the tips. I'll check my sync speed and do some more playing. I figure that if I can come close to mastering this with a borrowed flash, it will give me a bit more of a push to save for my own. I can already tell that the lighting is better than straight on camera flash, but I still have a ways to go.

You new "studio" sounds great. I need something like that at work too, as I've been taking a few product shots lately for posting on Amazon.

[brucep]

Here's a completely unretouched shot taken the first time I used that room. Natually I'll remove the background. I always need a bottle (and its base shadow) with no background so I can put it anywhere I need to.

Look at those subtle reflections. I simply darken/even out that middle area of the bottle (the back wall/ceiling) and it's good to go. Etched bottles are a challenge to photograph without showing obtrusive reflections. In the future I'm going to put seamless white paper on the table.

Keep us posted on your results with multiple ETTL flashes.

[PPPhoto]

Well, here is one of my latest trials. I got to thinking that the white background was really "blown out" quite as much as I would like. To solve this, I set my 420EX as the main, and used the 430EX as the background light, which I then set on Manual. This way I don't have to worry about the E-TTL system trying to dial back the light output. I also discovered that my camera was set at -1/3 flash exp. comp. I tried a few different settings for that, and ended up with liking either +2/3 or +1. I think that I might almost be getting the hang of it.

http://lh6.ggpht.com/pifersprophoto/SDnEWNMce8I/AAAAAAAABnI/F4BhHkc1wRM/s800/edit01_4120.jpg
I actually dialed the exposure down just a touch on this image (in Camera Raw). Other than that and a WB setting, (and a crop) I didn't touch this image.

[brucep]

That's looking good, Craig! I like the catchlights in her eyes.

In my experience, anytime I have one light source on manual (where I'm in control of it) and other sources on auto, the auto has tried to fight my manual source. I either use/manipulate them all in Auto or all on manual. It has just worked best that way for me.

I really enjoy the ETTL of my Canon flashes. I can dial in the results I want right from the flash or ST-E2 transmitter on camera. The ETTL system varies exposure as read at the sensor. When I'm using my manual Alien Bees, for instance, if I change the flash to subject distance, I have to adjust the power of the flash or change my f-stop. With ETTL it automatically compensates for that change in distance.

[jrsforums]

Bruce, the 550EX is my master, and the other two are the slaves. I did set my key light (430EX) as group A, the fill (550EX) as B, and the background (420EX) as C. I understand how to set the ratio with A and B, but I don't really understand how to set C properly.

When shooting the camera on manual, what's a good starting point for shutter and aperture? I guess I was assuming that the flashes would put enough light out to help with the exposure, but they don't seem to. Do I need to set my flash exp. comp. to the + side?

I still have some time to play with it before I have to give the 550EX back. I hope to get a 580EX for myself someday, maybe 2 580s, or perhaps another 430 with 1 580.

PP....

With Canon wireless, the master will always be in Group 'A', which may be some of the problem you are having.

Great set of tutorials on Canon wireless flash at:

http://super.nova.org/DPR/#Canon

John

[zeeman]

I really enjoy the ETTL of my Canon flashes....

You know Bruce, you're the kind of neighbour I would like to have next door lol lol lol

I'm still fighting my battle with the Canon flash system and its ratios.
:roll: