New ways of doing old things

[JimL]

I am a user of Paint Shop Pro X2 and Lightroom V2. Both are fine programs with PSPX2 being a much better editor dollar for dollar than any other program I have tried.
Lightroom 1.0 was a good organizer but was weak in basic editing so my work flow was to adjust exposure and specific colors for luminance, saturation, and (seldom) hue then switch to PSPX2 for the remainder of any editing.
Along comes Lightroom V2 and things are much easier because, in many of my pictures now, I do not have to change to PSP at all in order to get satisfactory results.
A problem arises when I need to selectively sharpen (or blur) portions of a photo. In PSPX2 there is a sharpen brush which applies the effect directly to the photo while in Lightroom v2 the process is done only with a mask. Carefully done, there is no perceptual difference in these techniques but, as I read the rules for the weekly challenge, the directly applied sharpen is legal but the brush with mask is not, requiring me to load and edit in a second program should I wish to enter the challenge. Because I have a 1gb ram computer I CAN use PSP while Lightroom is active but slow doesn't even begin to describe how long it takes to accomplish even a simple edit with both programs running. This usually means a save and possibly a resave operation is required. Wasted time.
The use of masks greatly simplifies getting professional results in areas of saturation, exposure, sharpness, and noise reduction and brushes that provide their own masks is a tool that was long overdue in my toolbox, and in digital photography, unlike traditional oil painting, there is no way to discern if layering or masking techniques were used to get the presentation results.
I would like to see the restrictions on masks removed from Photozo challenges in order to move with the modern times and, frankly, to help beginning photographers advance in skills that will be extremely useful to them if they ever want to compete in todays marketplace.
Just my thoughts on the subject.
JimL

[PPPhoto]

I think that having the rules as they are for the BWC does "help beginning photographers advance in skills that will be extremely useful". They are working on getting the shot as close to perfect in the camera. If the use of masks is essential, the monthly challenge is always available.

[yellalablady]

I didn't realize that Lightroom V2's sharpening was a mask. I know you can sharpen with a mask at the top of the right side, but I thought the sharpening that you have to scroll down to at the bottom of the right side was a USM.

[JimL]

The bottom sharpening at the bottom is a type of USM but it is universal. That is, it is applied to the whole photo uniformly where the brush at the top provides a segmented mask that only applies the sharpening to the areas covered by the brush stroke(s) and which can be selectively undone at any point in the editing process. In PSP the sharpen brush applies directly to the layer you are working with and once you pass the number of undo steps you have set in the program (4 in my case) it is permanent. In the USM sharpening your controls are the radius, and the strength, and the mask (or threshold) and the same radius is applied throughout the photo. Using the brush you can selectively apply different radii to different sections of the photo and, since the size of the radius directly effects how effective the sharpening is on different sized object, you can have a much better control over the overall sharpness and, in addition, much less chance of halos around sharply contrasting edges.

Craig I agree that people should try to get the best pictures from the camera that is possible and in fact I know of no one who tries to make defective photos just so they can get "good" photos in an editor. By the same token I no of no professional who doesn't use some editing prior to submitting pictures to a client or publication. I will readily admit that I don't know everyone and I have seen a wonderful photo which appeared in Life magazine taken with a borrowed brownie and sent un retouched to the editors there so evidently there are people who can do it. I can't. :-(
JimL

[PPPhoto]

Jim, from what you describe, the sharpening in PSP would, in my opinion, also violate the rules of the BWC. You may not be using a mask, but you are using selective sharpening, which give you the same effect. I think the intent of allowable sharpening within the constraints of this challenge is for an overall sharpening of the photo, not to have one section sharpened more than another.

Remember, it's a challenge. By having rules that limit the amount of editing that can be done, it includes more people that might not otherwise enter. You might know enough to really finesse your image into a masterpiece, but not everyone does. For someone that is struggling with going beyond the basics of cropping and resizing their image, it would be very intimidating to try to enter a challenge against an image that has been massaged to perfection.

Perhaps the rules do need to be updated. I have no problem with working within the current restraints, but I would also welcome the allowance of more advanced edits.

[JimL]

It was my interpretation of the rules that sharpening is allowed in BWC. It doesn't say one can only use USM. What about high pass sharpen or in some program just sharpen or sharpen more. If the contention is that the whole image has to be sharpened at once the brush could be used to cover the whole image although I will concede that it would generally be pointless to do so.
If the intent is to have images as they were taken by the camera, that is, resizing and conversion to jpg format only, that would be a fair and equitable way to run the contest even though many cameras can do sharpening, contrast, and saturation adjustments in camera. Once you allow sharpening, however, it seems odd, to me, that we would try to control what method(s) of sharpening when the content of the photo is a big determiner of how much and what type of sharpen works best. Many programs do not have USM even listed as a choice and I would venture to say that many users do not know exactly what the controls do when they do have USM so there is a skill set involved of which some people will be unable to take advantage.

Back to my original point about masking. Digital Photography has developed to the point where tools are commonly being used which were never even considered during the days when film ruled the publications. Masking is not, in my opinion, about making bad photos good. It is, to me, a method of making good photos better, overcoming limitations of light and equipment in the field.

JimL

[imagesbytlp]

As the rules stand now, you can use a sharpening tool as long as it is used universally.

It's funny that this is being brought up now...we are considering some changes for the BWC that would relax the current rules considerably. It would allow for dodging/burning, masking, filter's...etc. The thing is, it's important for a newer photographer to not only know the basics of photography...but, to know how to improve their image in post editing. So, they need to work on even applying a sharpening tool without overdoing it.